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August 01, 2011

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Mark

I'll take those odds, Mr. Armstrong - I say Putin will be the candidate. Although he may well have said he was tired of foreign policy, that's no reason to abandon it to amateurs, and Medvedev has shown a disturbing tendency to pander to the west on Russia's behalf - as he did with the treatment of Putin's "crusade" remark when it was nothing but the truth. He looked indecisive and too much the "popularity Jack" when he had to climb down a week or so later.

I have no particular substantiation for my bet, as you demonstrably have, and am betting on Putin only because I feel he believes he is the best man for the job - and he's right. If Medvedev gets the nod, I'll happily buy you a drink of choice whenever we may meet, which for my part I will seek out as soon as may be.

Patrick Armstrong

I just don’t get the Libya thing which features very strongly in the “Medvedev is incompetent” meme.

So let’s go through the options
1. Russia vetoes
a. NATO goes ahead anyway (vide Kosovo) and we are today just where we are today.
b. NATO says “golly, Russia’s against us, so we gotta do nothing”; Kadaffy’s forces enter Benghazi; massacre hundreds; MSM goes nuts; NATO says: “If only it weren’t for wicked Kadaffy-loving Russia, we would have saved hundreds of lives: Russia IS a Bad Guy after all”.
2. Russia abstains
a. NATO goes ahead and we are today just where we are today.

The bottom line is that the Libya imbroglio (days not weeks … weeks not months… months not years) continues and Russia can maybe/maybe (vide Kosovo) negotiate a solution. (Which NATO will not thank it for – or even acknowledge (vide Kosovo)).

So what’s Medvedev’s big crime/mistake/idiocy here?

BTW – I am not convinced (go to my Sitrep at the time) that Medvedev was responding to Putin’s remark – what is the precise timeline? After all “Crusader/Zionist” is the classic jihadist line and Gadaffy picked it up too.

Mark

Oh, I hope I didn't imply Medvedev is "incompetent" - once I might have said the idea of his leading for a second term made me nervous, but cooler heads such as Anatoly Karlin's, Eugene Ivanov's and your own convinced me I was reacting emotionally rather than rationally. I now agree Medevedev has made significant progress on reforms, which has - as usual - received short shrift in the western press for the most part. My error in that instance was railing against the western press while listening to it myself, and it was decidedly my error.

Abstention on the U.N. vote was exactly the right thing to do. You're quite right that NATO was bound to go ahead anyway, and a veto would have encouraged NATO to blame all civilian deaths on Russia, suggesting their action would have been much more broad-ranging were it not for trying to humor Russia in spirit if not in letter.

However, abstention was plenty on its own. Everyone could understand that Russia had to say, "Yer on yer own on this one, Muammar", because NATO's mind was made up before the vote, and a veto would have been worse than a useless gesture. Even the abstention rated some trademark snark from the expected quarters.

http://www.globalpost.com/dispatches/globalpost-blogs/bric-yard/russia-abstains-libya-vote

However, Putin's remark went a long way toward expressing Russia's dissatisfaction with the situation in general, and if Medvedev had kept his mouth shut (which was all he needed to do), Russia's position would have assumed the resonance of prophesy in light of how unpopular NATO's intervention is now. But instead, he looked like a western ass-kisser before the only group that really counts - the Russian voters.

That was the mistake. He made it appear Russia was bending over backward to appease the western crusaders - which, given their intervention on behalf of the minority against the express will of the majority, they are - and that he had jerked his Prime Minister up short at the behest of western overlords. It makes no difference if that was actually the case, and it wasn't - he simply spoke without thinking it through. Unity on that point would have made all the difference, and his language earned him strong rebukes in the Russian press and in blog comments. It might cost United Russia votes if Medvedev is the candidate, because it suggests he is too much under the thrall of the west and too eager to appease it when Russia should be standing up for its beliefs.

Patrick Armstrong

I think you are reading too much into the "crusader" remarks. Putin in Udmertia said what he said and 4 hours later in Moscow Medvedev said what he said. How certain are you that DAM knew what VVP had said?
BTW did you see that DAM didn't get a chance to talk directly with VVP about the Ossetia war for 24 hours?
http://eng.kremlin.ru/transcripts/2680
Russia is not so efficient (and neither is any other place) that everybody knows what everybody says immediately.

Mark

It's very likely you are exactly right, and I don't have anything like an inside track on who knew what when. It might very well be an unfortunate collision of circumstances, but if it was indeed coincidence it was devilishly timed to make it appear Medvedev was responding to Putin's remark. Equally unfortunately, that's the way every press source I read interpreted it and spun it. If Medvedev had spoken first, it'd be impossible to make that connection because it would have looked extremely strange for him to be going all stern about "crusader" remarks where none (except maybe Gaddafi's) had been offered. However, it seemed to seal the deal when he later walked back his position on Libya and appeared to move in the direction of Putin's initial interpretation - although he never used the word "crusaders" himself except to rebut it - by exhorting the west to see that it protects civilians when he had appeared very satisfied on that score just a day or two before.

It's quite true that many a political figure has been damaged by the media without cause, over a misunderstanding; however, when such is the case the figure in question typically tries to set the record straight - whether his/her explanation is accepted often depends on his/her popularity. For whatever reason, Medvedev chose to let the media version prevail without any attempt (that I saw) to address it beyond the apparent qualification of his original position on the issue.

Medvedev seems to be not a bad guy, and Russia could certainly do a lot worse; I don't doubt he will win if he is the candidate. But the last poll I saw (admittedly not up-to-the-minute) had Putin about 10 points ahead of him as voters' choice to run, which I took to mean a larger number of voters would vote for the UR candidate if it were Putin (although that's by no means guaranteed). Putin has a good deal more political experience, and seems to command more respect among both the business and the administrative classes. Lastly, the west loathes Putin. Given the west's apparent plan for Russia based on its overall tone and actions - especially with unstable figures like Ileana Ros-Lehtinen given a prominent voice - I'd interpret that as a suggestion that he was the man for the job if I were a Russian voter. But my pick is certainly no more scientific than that.

No, I hadn't known that detail about the delay regarding the Ossetia situation; that's interesting, and certainly lends weight to your viewpoint, thanks for it. The Kremlin site is up and down for me - sometimes I have difficulty accessing it (maybe it's just busy).

Anyway, if I'm right about who runs for President, it'll be just a flip-of-a-coin kind of thing, based more on what I'd like to see happen than on what the omens argue.

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